Friday, February 1, 2008

MY PREWRATH TESTIMONY

When friends of mine, a family with four children, began fellowshipping at my church, I saw right away that the husband was a student of the Word. Our church holds a Discipleship Institute in the spring and fall in lieu of our evening service. During the fall Discipleship Institute of ’06, the husband who was teaching one of the classes at the time, mentioned the prewrath view regarding the timing of the rapture. Since he was such a Bible scholar I wanted to learn more. I'd just always accepted the pretrib view because it was what I grew up with.

He pointed me to a couple of books. I first picked up Marv Rosenthal’s book “The Prewrath Rapture of the Church”. When I realized that Mr. Rosenthal was saying that the Church would face the persecution of Antichrist I was gripped with fear. What struck me though was the fact that he was employing the golden rule of interpretation: “When the plain sense makes sense, seek no other sense.” After finishing the book I went back and read it again only this time with my Bible in hand. I compared Scripture with Scripture. Scripture never contradicts Scripture. When there appears to be contradiction on the surface, the student must dig deeper and find the common denominator that makes all the passages fit. When that happens the student finds truth.

I next read Robert Van Kampen’s book “The Sign.” He too followed a face-value hermeneutic and allowed Scripture to interpret Scripture. I googled prewrath. I read everything I could find on it. It soon became apparent to me and I am now 100% convinced that the prewrath view of the timing of the rapture is the most biblically sound of all the rapture models. Not one Scripture on the events surrounding the return of Christ and our gathering contradicts another when placed within the framework of the prewrath rapture model. Once I understood prewrath, I saw elements of it EVERYWHERE in Scripture.

I was taught that the seals were God's wrath, His vengeful judgment. Yet the 5th seal martyrs in Rev. 6:10 ask God how long until He avenges their blood. Are they confused? They know they weren’t suffering under the hand of God’s wrathful judgment. God’s answer to them is to wait a little while longer until the number of their fellow servants and their brethren who were to be killed is complete. (Rev. 6:11) By their question and God’s answer we can soundly conclude that God’s wrath is yet to come. God has promised His children that they will not face His wrath. (1 Th. 5:9) He would be breaking His promise if His wrath was being poured out during the opening of the seals.

Rev. 12:12,13,17 identifies the persecution against Israel and those who hold to the testimony of Jesus as the wrath of Satan. “Woe to the earth and the sea, because the devil has come down to you, having great wrath, knowing that he only has a short time…And when the dragon saw that he was thrown down to the earth, he persecuted the woman (Israel) who gave birth to the male child…And the dragon was enraged with the woman (who was now protected in the wilderness), and went off to make war with the rest of her offspring, who keep the commandments of God and hold to the testimony of Jesus (believers). ”

Jesus said in John 16:33 that in the world we will have tribulation. The Greek word for tribulation is “thlipsis”. It can be translated also as pressure, persecution, or affliction. It is believers who endure affliction now, for the word of their testimony and for His name’s sake. It will be believers who will face unprecedented pressure and affliction during the great tribulation, for the word of their testimony, for His name’s sake. God’s guns of wrath on the other hand are going to be aimed at sinners, not to His beloved children, during a specific period called the day of the Lord.

Zephaniah 1:14a: Near is the great day of the LORD, near and coming very quickly…” 1:15: “A day of wrath is that day, a day of trouble and distress, a day of destruction and desolation, a day of darkness and gloom, a day of clouds and thick darkness…” 1:17: “I will bring distress on men, so that they will walk like the blind, because they have sinned against the LORD; and their blood will be poured out like dust…” 1:18…”And all the earth will be devoured in the fire of His jealousy, for He will make a complete end, indeed a terrifying one, of all the inhabitants of the earth.”

Is. 2:12: “For the LORD of hosts will have a day of reckoning against everyone who is proud and lofty, , and against everyone who is lifted up, that he may be abased…” v.17 “ …the pride of man will be humbled, and the loftiness of men will be abased, and the LORD alone will be exalted in that day.”

Another interesting thing to note is in Rev. 7 John sees the 144,000 being sealed after the sixth seal. If the seals are God’s wrath, they would need to be sealed before the first seal.

I was taught that the entire 70th Week of Daniel is the day of the Lord. We just saw that Isaiah 2:17 says that during the day of the Lord the Lord alone will be exalted. Paul tells us in 2 Th. 2:4 that the man of lawlessness, the son of destruction, will exalt himself as God in the temple. We understand Paul’s reference of this exaltation of the man of lawlessness to be the abomination of desolation in the temple spoken of by Daniel in 9:27. This will occur at the midpoint of the Week. When the son of destruction exalts himself many will fall in line under him and worship him by taking his mark. God alone will not be exalted during this time. The day of the Lord therefore must occur sometime after the midpoint of Daniel’s 70th Week.

In Gen. 1:14, when God called the lights into being, not only were they to separate night from day, He also said, “…and let them be for signs…” God is going to give the world a sign that His day of wrath is about to begin. We find it in Joel 2:31, Mt. 24:29, and Rev. 6:12,13. The natural lights are going to be extinguished.

Joel 2:31 says the lights will go out before the day of the Lord. “The sun will be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and awesome day of the LORD comes.”

In Mt. 24:29, they go out immediately after the tribulation which begins just after the abomination of desolation, which occurs at the midpoint of the Week. “But immediately after the tribulation of those days THE SUN WILL BE DARKENED, AND THE MOON WILL NOT GIVE ITS LIGHT, AND THE STARS WILL FALL from the sky, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken.”

Rev. 6:12,13 tells us this triple sign in the sun, moon, and stars occurs at the opening of the sixth seal. “And I looked when He broke the sixth seal, and there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth made of hair, and the whole moon became like blood; and the stars of the sky fell to the earth…”

Remember how the fifth seal martyrs call for God’s wrath? The sixth seal announces that it is about to occur!

Comparing Scripture with Scripture and using sound reasoning, the day of the Lord’s wrath is not going to encompass the entire 70th Week of Daniel but will begin sometime after the midpoint of Daniel’s 70th Week. The sequence at the midpoint of the Week: The abomination of desolation, Antichrist exalts himself, then severe, unprecedented persecution against Israel and God’s elect, then God’s wrath.

According to Mt. 24:21,22, the days of persecution will be cut short for the sake of the elect otherwise no life will be saved. “…for then there will be a great tribulation, such as has not occurred since the beginning of the world until now, nor ever shall. And unless those days (of tribulation) had been cut short, no life would have been saved; but for the sake of the elect those days shall be cut short.”

To say the entire 70th Week of Daniel is tribulation and is also the day of the Lord does not line up with Scripture. The time of great tribulation and the day of the Lord encompass two different time periods within Daniel’s 70th Week and are aimed at two different groups of people. Satan is responsible for the affliction against Israel and those who hold to the testimony of Jesus. God is responsible for the period of wrath. The triple sign in the heavens separates the two. We will soon see that the rapture, the gathering of the elect, the Church, does as well!

The pretrib position advocates that Mt. 24 does not apply to the Church yet we will go to Mt. 18 for instruction on church discipline. Is it right to leave out the instructions and warnings of our Lord in Mt. 24? Consider this: Jesus said in the last verse of Matthew, “Go therefore and make disciples of all nations (not just the Jews)teaching them to observe all I commanded you.” We tend to focus on the word “teach” but we are to teach new disciples to observe all that the Lord commanded. The warnings and instructions in Mt. 24 do apply to the Church! (I don’t know of any orthodox Jew who goes to Mt. 24 for instruction on prophecy.) Our Lord’s very last words in Matthew are "...and lo, I am with you (the Church) always, even to the end of the age."

The end of the age has not ceased before the events in the Olivet Discourse. Therefore, the Church age has not come to fruition before the events in the Olivet Discourse.

Matthew 24:13,14, 15a: “But the one who endures to the end, he shall be saved. And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in the whole world for a witness to all the nations, and then the end shall come…Therefore when you see the abomination of desolation…”

If the Church age has not ceased before the events in the Olivet Discourse, the Church will not be raptured prior to the great tribulation.

Jesus said in Mt. 24:22 that the tribulation will be cut short for the sake of the elect. (Daniel’s 70th Week will not be cut short, but the persecution against the God’s elect.)

Then He instructs us in Mt. 24:29-31: “But immediately after the tribulation of those days THE SUN WILL BE DARKENED, AND THE MOON WILL NOT GIVE ITS LIGHT, AND THE STARS WILL FALL from the sky, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken, (His day of wrath is about to occur, but first), AND THEN THE SIGN OF THE SON OF MAN WILL APPEAR IN THE SKY, AND THEN ALL THE TRIBES OF THE EARTH WILL MOURN, AND THEY WILL SEE THE SON OF MAN COMING ON THE CLOUDS OF THE SKY WITH POWER AND GREAT GLORY. AND HE WILL SEND FORTH HIS ANGELS WITH A GREAT TRUMPET AND THEY WILL GATHER TOGETHER HIS ELECT FROM THE FOUR WINDS, FROM ONE END OF THE SKY TO THE OTHER.”

Jesus IS referring to our gathering here, when He comes to receive us unto Himself!

In verse 36 He tells us His coming and our gathering will occur on a day and hour known only by the Father. Pretrib will use this verse to refer to a pretrib rapture yet will deny that the gathering Jesus is speaking of only five verses earlier is the Church! Here is another inconsistency with the pretrib position.

If we would consistently follow a simple, face-value hermeneutic and let Scripture interpret Scripture, the answer as to the timing of the rapture is right before our eyes. It is not before the tribulation but at the end! (Not the end of Daniel’s 70th Week. God’s wrath falls during the remainder of the Week. The Church will be gathered and then the day of the Lord’s wrath will commence.)

You might wonder where Rev. 19 fits into all of this. There John sees Christ on a white horse with a robe dipped in blood. He has been active in pouring out His wrathful vengeance after He gathered the elect, the Church. The Mt. 24 appearance is at some point between the middle of Daniel’s 70th Week and the end, before God’s wrath or “prewrath”. Rev. 19 is a later appearance to face and defeat the beast and his armies at the Battle of Armageddon, when God’s wrath will be complete. The Greek word for “coming” in Mt. 24 is “parousia”. It means “presence”. Christ, at His first coming, appeared initially in a stable. His presence remained for 33 years. His initial presence at His second coming will be in the clouds with His angels to gather the elect. He appears again later on for the Battle of Armageddon.

If the sum of God’s word is truth as the Psalmist says, Paul’s instruction on the second coming should line up with Christ’s and occur in connection with the day of the Lord.

Look at what Paul says in 2 Th. 2. He neatly ties the coming of the Lord, our gathering, and the day of the Lord all together:

1…” Now we request you, brethren, with regard to the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him [THE RAPTURE],”

2…” that you not be quickly shaken from your composure or be disturbed either by a spirit or a message or a letter as if from us, to the effect that the Day of the Lord [the DAY OF HIS WRATH or VENGEANCE] has come.”


3…” Let no one in any way deceive you, for it [THE DAY/TIME OF WRATH and CHRIST’S COMING AND OUR GATHERING WHICH PAUL JUST TIED TOGETHER] will not come unless the APOSTASY comes FIRST, and the MAN OF LAWLESSNESS [THE ANTI-CHRIST] is revealed [at the ABOMINATION of DESOLATION, in the middle of Daniel’s 70th Week], the son of destruction…”

Just prior to that Paul had written to them these words in verse 4: “…we ourselves speak proudly of you among the churches of God for your perseverance and faith in the midst of all your persecutions and afflictions which you endure.” Someone had told the Thessalonians that the suffering they were enduring was the day of the Lord’s wrath and they had missed the rapture. Paul cleared things up by telling them that before the rapture occurs the revealing of Antichrist will happen first, when he exalts himself in the temple. The sequence: The revealing of Antichrist, the Lord comes, the rapture occurs, and then the day of His wrath gets underway. Paul lines up perfectly with Christ’s teaching in Mt. 24 on the timing of the rapture during Daniel’s 70th Week! He also lines up with Isaiah who says that during the day of the Lord only He will be exalted.

Luke’s parallel account to Mt. 24 is in 21:25-27. He too records the triple sign of the sun, moon, and stars. “And there will be signs in the sun and moon and stars, and upon the earth dismay among the nations, in perplexity at the roaring of the sea and the waves, men fainting from fear and the expectation of the things which are coming upon the world; for the powers of the heavens will be shaken. And then they will see THE SON OF MAN COMING IN A CLOUD with power and great glory.”

Luke says men will faint from fear at the things which are coming upon the earth. What is about to come upon the earth? From the triple sign we know it is the arrival of the day of the Lord!! Imagine the natural lights suddenly going out on a bright, sunny day. If you are on the other side of the earth looking at a bright full moon, imagine the terror if it were to all of a sudden turn red and the stars were to vanish as well. That would scare the socks off of anyone!!

Here is what the believer’s response should be when the lights go out: Verse 28: “But when these things (the signs in the sky and the roaring of the waves) begin to take place, straighten up and lift up your heads, because your redemption is drawing near.”

Jesus return, our gathering, our ransom in full, our deliverance is imminent at this point!

If we know what we are to be watching for and are prepared, the day of the Lord will not come as a thief in the night to us! (1 Th. 5:4)

The verses and passages regarding the Lord’s coming and our gathering had always been confusing to me. Once they were all placed under the prewrath framework the clarity was stunning!

Some wonderful things have happened as a result of my study. First, my love for the Lord’s appearing has increased exponentially. It was like I experienced the joy of salvation all over again because I completely understood the truths surrounding the Lord’s return. Anytime we sing about it in church my heart just soars with praise and anticipation. Sad but true, while resting in a pretrib rapture, I would go for days, if not weeks, never thinking about the return of Christ. Understanding now that the signs in Mt. 24 are for the Church, I’ve become a watchman. What’s constantly in the news? Peace for the Middle East! Daniel’s 70th Week gets underway when a covenant is confirmed with Israel.

Second, I no longer fear the coming persecution. Will it be a scary time? Absolutely! But should I find myself in the generation that will face the wrath of Satan, I am so much more prepared and my family is too. Rev. 13:7 says the beast’s authority is going to extend worldwide. The Church in America is not going to be exempt. The question is will she be ready? All those resting in a pretrib rapture will be utterly confused. Christ warns the Church in Mt. 24 that many false Christs will arise during that time. It is far better to understand what is going to happen now, before it actually occurs. We will be prepared and not prone to fall for the deception.

Jesus clearly tells us He will return just after the lights go out, in the sky, in the clouds. It is going to be a noisy, glorious event, not a silent, secret event! In Mt. 24:23 He warns, “Then if anyone says to you, ‘Behold, here is the Christ, or there He is,’ do not believe him.” Verses 25-26: “Behold, I have told you in advance. If therefore they say to you, ‘Behold, He is in the wilderness’, do not go forth, or, ‘Behold, He is in the inner rooms,’ do not believe them.” A genuine believer will not take the mark and worship the beast, but could be lured out of hiding if they haven’t been instructed in Mt. 24. I would prefer to straighten up and lift up my head when the lights go out rather than to have it lopped off prior to that because I didn’t heed the Lord’s warnings! No doubt, there will those who first make sure their families are protected, drilling them to remember the Lord's instructions and warnings to stay put. While helping others then they will be martyred for their faith, but it won't be because they weren't prepared.

Third, I’ve become much bolder in the Faith. I’m not as timid as I was in my conversation with strangers regarding the Faith.

Last, knowing what is going to happen also has had a purifying effect. Peter even talks about it in 2 Pe. 3:11,12,14: “Since all these things are to be destroyed in this way (Peter just spoke about the day of the Lord that will be coming), what sort of people ought you to be in holy conduct and godliness, looking for and hastening the coming day of God, on account of which the heavens will be destroyed by burning, and the elements will melt with intense heat!... Therefore, beloved, since you look for these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace, spotless, and blameless.”

With conviction in my heart that this is the truth regarding our Lord’s return, I desire greatly to have others learn of the prewrath position as well. My conscience no longer allows me the assurance of a pretrib rapture. My desire is to be obedient to Christ and all His instructions. My desire is that others will be prepared as well.

I hope I’ve convinced you to embark on a study of the prewrath position!

Mt. 24:3…”what will be the sign of Your coming, and the end of the age? Verse 4: “See to it that no one misleads you…”

His to the End,
Kathy

Revelation 12:11: “And they overcame him (Satan) because of the blood of the Lamb and because of the word of their testimony, and they did not love their life even to death.”

13 comments:

Marge said...

Hi Kathy!

I gotta say, you've been doing your homework, and it is all very interesting, I must say.

However, I've been reading: 3:16 The Numbers of Hope, by Max Lucado. Which I would recommend to anyone, as it is excellent! And when you take a break from studying prophecy, have you read, Driven By Eternity, by John Bevere yet? It's one of my favorite ALL time favorite books, as it's a book within a book. (kinda like a "wheel within a wheel :) And oddly enough, as good as Driven By Eternity is? John Bevere believes we're (the Church) going thru the tribulation :( So, as you already know, our belief in the Rapture doesn't actually affect our salvation, or our desire to please God, and serve Him. Anyhow, a couple of good books to read :)
(I have no idea as to Max Lucado's view of the Rapture, though)

Have a good weekend!
That groundhog! Six more weeks of Winter? LOL. Hopefully, not :)

Love,
Marge

Anonymous said...

Welcome to Overcomer Marge!

I've been real busy with pics but I did take a break to rewrite my testimony. Did you read my post at Joel's about how the end of the age ties into allowing the Church to be in Matthew 24?

We can't be in the tribulation. You know why don't you? No peace treaty yet, no A of D yet. The antichrist has not been revealed yet. We'll know when we are in the tribulation, believe me!

I'm looking for a couple of things to happen prior to that. War breaking out in the Middle East and/or economies all over the world collapsing. So many accountants are warning about it.

Twenty-eight Ground Hog Days ago my husband proposed to me! He gave me a card that made me belly laugh.

We certainly shouldn't have to worry about a drought with all the snow in the mountains, right?

Bye for now,

Love from Kathy

Anonymous said...

Was quite surprised to see you on the Rapture Ready Pre-Trib site.

The specific number of days in Daniel's 70th week as specified in the Holy Bible is the shortened time. If Jesus doesn't return on that exact day no flesh would be saved, just as the Bible states.

Aren't you glad that our God knows the end before it happens and graciously put it in the Bible so that we might understand.

Maranatha!

Anonymous said...

1 John 5:5

Who is he who overcomes the world, but he who believes that Jesus is the Son of God?

Kathy Hall said...

Thanks for dropping by Hanging on to the Blessed Hope. I didn't know I was on the Rapture Ready Pre-Trib web site. You said: "The specific number of days in Daniel's 70th week as specified in the Holy Bible is the shortened time. If Jesus doesn't return on that exact day no flesh would be saved, just as the Bible states." Are you referring to Mt. 24:22 as the shortened time? The context is the days of tribulation, not Daniel's 70th Week, if I understand what you are saying. Jesus is saying the days of tribulation that begin after the AofD will be cut short. Can you point me to where at Rapture Ready I am being mentioned? I hope they are saying good things! Thanks again for dropping in.

Psalm 104:1: "Bless the LORD, O my soul! O LORD my God, Thou art very great; Thou are clothed with splendor and majesty."

Anonymous said...

Overcomer,

I just assumed this was you.

http://www.rr-bb.com/showthread.php?t=33231

If not, I'm sorry.

Kathy Hall said...

Hanging On,

That wasn't me. No worries! I do appreciate you getting back to me.

Kathy Hall said...

As far as Mt. 24:22, Jesus is telling His disciples, believers, that for those believers who are around for the great tribulation, the days of tribulation within Daniel's 70th Week will be cut short. The persecution is going to be so fierce, there would be no believers left if the Lord didn't cut that time short with His coming to deliver those who remain alive.

Anonymous said...

Hi Kathy,

It's Jim in Salem, Oregon. I commented once before on a differently named blog site you had before (if my memory is correct). Anyway, I have a question. How do we reconcile the following passage from Luke with other Scriptures regarding the rapture happening in the twinkling of an eye? I'm told that the fact that this passage from Luke (and the parallel passage in Matthew) indicating that people will see the Lord supports the view that these passages are talking about the time when the Lord comes back at Armageddon (as opposed to when he comes to take His Bride home).

"...And then they will see THE SON OF MAN COMING IN A CLOUD with power and great glory.”

My guess is that the passages about the suddenness of the Rapture has to do more with how suddenly it commences rather than how long it actually takes (though I think Scripture points to it occurring very suddenly and the actual rapture event being short in duration).

I'm definitely not as knowledgeable about all of this as you are but I do agree that a pre-wrath view appears to me to definitely fit best with Scripture

Kathy Hall said...

Hi Jim,

The "twinkling" reference you are referring to is found in 1 Cor. 15:52. Let's back up to the verse before. V. 51:

"Behold, I tell you a mystery; we shall not all sleep, but we shall be changed,..."

V. 52 "...in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump; for the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we shall be changed."

If we read those verses carefully the "twinkling of an eye" is referring to the speed at which we are changed, not to how quickly we are raised up in the rapture.

I just posted a comment at another blog regarding the parallel accounts in the gospels of the coming of the Son of Man and Paul's account of Christ's coming and the rapture in 1 Th. 4:14-18 and Rev. 19. I'm going to go ahead and post it below. I was in a conversation with a gal who didn't see Mt. 24 as a gathering of the elect from the earth. Perhaps what I posted to Angie will answer some of your questions as well. Thanks so much for dropping in again. I think I remember you. =)

Angie,

Because Jesus doesn’t specifically mention the earth does that mean the elect from the earth are not gathered? What has been going on in Mt 24? After the AofD there is great tribulation/persecution against the elect. The days of tribulation are cut short for the sake of the elect. What happens immediately after the tribulation? The lights go out signaling the end of the age and the Son of Man comes in the clouds with His angels. Then what? The angels gather the elect from the four winds. Let’s think here for a minute. Prior to Christ’s coming the elect are being persecuted. Does it make sense to say that the gathering of the elect does not involve removing them from the persecution on the earth just because the gathering is from the four winds? Of course not. Comparing Scripture with Scripture, Mark’s account shows us it involves a gathering from the earth. Let’s go to Luke’s account. Luke 21:25 records the triple signs and also says the sea and the waves will roar. Verse 26 says the heavens are shaken. Verse 27 records the coming of the Son of Man. What does verse 28 say? “When these things begin to take place, straighten up and lift up YOUR heads, because YOUR redemption is drawing near.” What are “these things” and who is Luke talking to? “These things” are the lights going out and the roaring of the sea and waves and the heavens being shaken in vv. 25-26. Luke is talking to believers. Only believers will see redemption. V. 26 says men (unbelievers) will faint from fear but when “you”, the believer, see these things, don’t faint, look up. Our ransom in full, our deliverance is just about to occur! When we put all three accounts together, comparing Scripture with Scripture, we get the big picture. When the lights go out signaling the end of the age look up, the persecution will end, Christ will appear, and we will be gathered by the angels.

Now let’s go to 1 Th. 4:14-18.

Where did Paul get his information regarding the coming of the Lord and that “the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trumpet of God; and the dead in Christ shall rise first and we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air”? 1 Th. 4:15: “For this we say to you BY THE WORD OF THE LORD.” Paul’s teaching came directly from Christ and includes more information, giving us an even bigger picture. When Christ comes the elect are gathered but the dead are raised first!

Now, let’s compare Mt. 24 and Rev. 19. What is happening in each account?

Mt. 24: The persecution of the elect. The lights go out. Christ appears with the angels. There’s a great trumpet. The angels gather the elect.

Rev. 19: The beast and the kings of the earth with their armies are assembled to make war against the KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS who comes down on a white horse with a robe dipped in blood and the armies of heaven are with Him clothed in fine linen and are following Him on white horses too.

The only mention of a gathering in Rev. 19 is that of birds to eat the flesh of Christ’s enemies.

Let me ask you one last thing. Does 1 Th. 4:14-18 sound more like Paul is describing Rev. 19 or Mt. 24?

Anonymous said...

Thanks Kathy,

I actually saw that post of yours on Joel's blog. That's where I first stumbled across you and your insiteful comments. Keep up the good work. My wife has been participating in a Beth Moore Bible study on the book of Daniel at our church. She asked me last night about to explain once again how I understand the Bible to explain how things come together in the end. I explained to her my pre-wrath position. I was up late last night and left the computer open to the diagram you drew of Daniel's 70th week.

Well today was Angie's Bible study day. She said that in the video they watched, Beth Moore drew out her understanding of the 70th week described in Daniel. Angie said when she came home today, it was so wierd to see go to the computer and see a diagram of Daniel's 70th week! She did say that yours was much more detailed and of course the rapture was at a different spot than where Beth Moore placed it;-) But, she does say that Beth is not at all dogmatic about the pre-trib view and encourages everyone to search out the Scriptures just as you do.

One last thing. Thanks for your testimony about how the Lord has worked in your heart and drawn you close to Him since He revealed to you this pre-wrath framework in Scripture. I do want the Lord to do the same in me. I do embrace the framework but I need the Lord to help me get excited about His coming. I mean I am excited but I don't look forward to the things He said we will face. Anyway, not my will but His.

I've also been thinking about how we (His servants) are not above Him (our Master and Savior). It seems to me that the Body of Christ will suffer what He did when He was here on earth with us. Just as He was persecuted greatly just before He was crucified, His Bride will be. Just as the world killed Him, they will kill His Body (the Church). Just as He was raised from the dead and then ascended to Heaven, the dead in Christ will be raised and we who are in Christ will ascend into heaven in the rapture.

What do you think?

Anonymous said...

Oops. I wrote "insiteful comments." That should have read "insightful comments." :-)
I constantly see typos after I post but rarely catch them before I post regardless of how much I proofread first.

Kathy Hall said...

My thoughts first went to my friend Kristen Wisen's verse that she wrote under her name when she sent me her book, "The Appearing". (As you can see, I highly recommend it!) Luke 9:23: "If anyone wishes to come after Me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me." We don't know if we are the generation called to enter into the terrible time that will be coming upon the earth. We always need to be ready however to hold to the testimony of Jesus, no matter what the cost. I have no doubt He will give us His wonderful grace to be overcomers. Hold fast till He comes!

Oh, by the way, I am making a new and improved chart and will be posting it soon.